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Public safety is one of the core functions of government. But in Oregon and Washington lawmakers made cuts to corrections as part of their effort to balance budgets hit hard from the ongoing recession.
In Washington, at least so far, cuts have focused on layoffs and reductions in what's called "community corrections" — supervising nonviolent, low and moderate risk inmates who have been released. Washington's Department of Corrections says, with one or two exceptions, almost no one is getting out early - yet.
In Oregon, the situation is a little different.
Lawmakers in the Oregon legislature were both lauded and cursed for saving money by delaying the implimentation of Measure 57—a voter passed intiative that mandated sentences for certain drug and property crimes. The bill that put off M57 also allowed the state to give inmates more time off their sentences for good behavior, decrease probation times and, like Washington, send certain incarcerated immigrants who have committed nonviolent offenses back to their home countries early.
Did you vote for Measure 57? What do you think of its suspension? Have you been the victim of a nonviolent crime? Do you have concerns about reducing supervision for some ex-cons in Oregon and Washington?
GUESTS:
- Craig Prins: Executive director of the Oregon Criminal Justice Commission
- Steve Doell: President of Crime Victims United
- Scott Blonien: Assistant secretary for Washington Department of Corrections
- Jorge Baron: Executive director of the Northwest Immigrants Rights Project
- Mike Cooke: Commander with Clark County Sheriff's office
Tagged as: prison · washington
Photo credit: *One* / Creative Commons
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Budget cuts to prisons first imply that potentially violent and recidivist criminals will be released back into the relatively low-crime environment of today
Not necessarily. In 2007, arrests for just marijuana possession alone (no violence involved, simply possession) outnumbered the arrests for all violent crimes by a slightly less than 300,000 (872,720 vs. 597,447).
I am totally fine with releasing 872,720 people who are in jail for simply possessing marijuana. That's just expensive and serves no purpose.
[http://www.drugwarfacts.org/]
The cure remains the elimination of the causes of fear, ignorance, poverty and suffering. Education and opportunity are necessary for the development of a worthy society.
Agreed 100%. This is why Thomas Jefferson was an outspoken advocate of public education and why I support it very strongly.
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Well, trurl9 and slakr007, I think you've pretty well covered this one.
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We can spend money on education or on prisons. Research has shown for many years that education is the better investment.
Mandatory sentences for non-violent crimes have a serious downside most people are not aware of. The longer a person is in prison, the lower their probablility of successfully reintegrating back into the community. Measure 11 has created career criminals by forcing many youth, particularly young men, to spend too many of their formative years living with adult criminals. Outcomes are much better when these youth a diverted into programs that deal with the underlying issues (criminogenic factors).
There are two kinds of people in prison: those who are a threat to society and those we are simply mad at. We need to find alternatives for dealing more effectively with the latter group.
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I agree with Mr. Doell that Oregonians want more from their law enforcement and corrections systems. The problem is that Oregonians also have made clear they don't want to pay the cost of these systems. We have been struggling for years with unfunded criminal justice mandates resulting from initiatives that sound great but are not achievable without adequate funding -- that is, higher taxes. We have to come to terms with costs -- which is what Mr. Prins is talking about. That's not the "government perspective" as Mr. Doell calls it. That is reality.
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Steve Doell assumes that prisons serve the public good.
More and more research shows that they do not. People imprisoned for non-violent crimes are more likely to commit a violent crime after being released. In other words, prison tends to instill violence rather than rehabilitate. How is that useful?
I would also like to know the source of his 700% increase statistic. The FBI considered a 2.5% increase in 2005 a "surge". I would like to know how the FBI would describe a 700% increase.
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Hello - The issue of public support for crime prevention is more complicated than your guest, Steve, states. Voters in Lane County have repeatedly turned down levies to keep/add sheriff's patrols, etc. There are consquences for these actions by the voting public. It's too simplistic to simply blame the legislature for undersupporting our crime prevention networks.
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Steve Doell asked: "What's the problem with increasing the budget by $2B?"
The problem is: it is a never ending cycle that perpetually increases costs and does not solve the problem.
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Personally, I would like to see Oregon follow a model that President Obama outlined for the national government. No bill should be enacted unless the bill itself INCLUDES an adequate funding source to fulfill the bills provisions.
I'd be very surprised if people were still so willing to vote yes on draconian prison sentencing if they were voting on a tax to cover the prisoner increases at the same time.
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Agreed. We added a similar requirement to the Florida constitution. Any proposed amendment to the Florida constitution has to include a financial impact statement, prepared by an independent group within the state government, on the ballot itself.
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Just a quick comment- with the first guest Emily was using the word "parole" and the guest was responding using the word "probation". Both are supervision but are different animals. Have to tune out when at work- as an ex-p.o., I hope you have a p.o. on for insight on what the cuts will mean in the real world. Thx for a good program.
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Gotcha, thanks!
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It's time to start putting money into prevention programs rather than continuing to pour so many dollars into prisons.
Earned time seems like it would provide an incentive to participate in programs such as educational and drug or alcohol treatment. We need to remember that the vast majority of people get out of prison at some point. We should be helping them succeed.
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Much of the first part of the show focused on the increase in earned time from 20% to a possible 30% in Oregon for people convicted of non-violent crimes. Washington increased earned time up to 50% in 2003 for certain people. Research done by the Washington State Institute for Public Policy shows that crime rates did not increase and the public saved money. You can read the report http://www.wsipp.wa.gov/rptfiles/08-11-1201.pdf . I think it's pretty clear that increases in earned time promote public safety and save money for the programs we should invest in that prevent crime like after school programs or reentry programs.
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Most inmates are in prison either directly or indirectly because of an addition to drugs/alcohol. When they are released without a job and without a safe house in which to live, they will usually return to their drug/alcohol usage pattern. Spending the last year or more of their sentence in a low cost addiction program where they gradually earn independence is a far better solution. They would earn the right to a job with much of their income going to the cost of their program. Food stamps would pay for much of their food. Most "staff" work like cooking, cleaning, and routine maintenance would be done by the inmates. They would gradually earn more and more opportunities to lead a normal life (go to the store, go for a walk, visit a person). They would have the certainty of returning to prison if they failed to stay sober.
Most addition programs are designed for intensive 3-4 week interventions. This is sufficient for detoxification, but has little permanent effect given the person has a long term addiction and irregular employment history. Low cost treatment is a large place, perhaps 30 beds, where there our AA type daily meetings and low cost group counseling along with help finding a job. Once the person shows he or she can hold a job and has at least 6 months in the program, they could go to a safe house for the rest of the time. They would be subject to random drug tests (scheduled so as not to prevent them from keeping their job). They would go back to prison for failure and there could be an extension on their original sentence.
The recidivism is because their is no meaningful transition from a total institution to total freedom. This lack of a meaningful transition coupled with a history of addiction leads to an enormous failure rate. I've talked to a PO in Canada who said that most inmates had a job placement and a place to live when released and the PO would help them keep their job, find a new job, and find alternative housing. This makes more sense than a bus ticket to downtown Portland. I believe that Canada has a much lower recidivism rate and actually has fewer people in prison in all of Canada than we have in Oregon.
The idea of spending $30,000 to $50,000 per year to keep people incarcerated and almost nothing to help them transition to a normal life after release is neither cost effective nor likely to reduce recidivism.
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So much of our manufacturing has gone overseas to third world countries because of lower labor costs. Would it not be a good idea to create a joint system with another country for them to house our prisoners. It would be a great specialty for a country with few natural resources and an increased incentive for offenders to correct their behavior.
Nancy
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Yes, by all means, lets create PENAL COLONIES in other countries. Great idea.
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@ DeniseW
Hey! It worked out OK for Australia; they are a world power now!
I'm kidding.
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Having a close relative who is a career criminal, he's been in jail most of his adult life, I see the problem in a different way. The one thing that never happened for this kid was to take responsibility for his actions. Even when he spent 9 years in a row on one charge he never accepted any responsibility for his actions (armed bank robbery). He (and his mom) spent his whole time working on trying to get off, get out on a technicality, good behavior, anything but admit he had made a mistake and needed help repairing his life. Oh he did become a raging born again christian and racial bigot, even though he himself has mixed blood.
The system always returns him to his mother and they are a totally poisonous relationship. Returning him to family is a big mistake and hurts all the other members. Also no one in the family can help him everything is too complicated. I know he will commit a crime to go back to jail, he has been out 6 months now. I think it is the only place he feels safe. It contains him. Lots of bad things happened to him but he has never dealt with it. His mother protects him and won't let him grow up even though she doesn't know it.
He actually does pretty well in prison because he has the structure and disclpiline he needs.
He scares me. He is the kind of guy who picks fights and gets beat up at the same time.
Oh and it is so easy to scam a parole officer even though harder than before.
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I am the victim of both a violent crime (sexual abuse) and a non-violent crime (identity theft). I voted for M57. And I fully support the legislature's decision to suspend it next year. I disagree with your guest Mr. Doell's statement that crime victims demand long sentences. He certainly doesn't speak for me or for many people I know who have also been victimized by crime. I certainly don't want the two people who committed crime against me to commit crime against anyone else. That's why I support earned time for prisoners. Shouldn't a period of incarceration be about helping people who have committed crime make better decisions in the future? That's what I want. Increasing earned time--increasing better decisions in prison--should lead to better decisions when people return to the community. I want my legislators to invest my tax dollars into programs that prevent crime (mentoring programs, education, health care, addiction treatment) and help people put their lives back together (victim services programs, re-entry programs).
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I guess I am too late with this, but it seems to mostly contradict the CVU's claims.
[http://www.das.state.or.us/DAS/OEA/docs/prison/index_crime_oregon.pdf]
Page 7 shows Oregon's violent crime rate as much less than the national rate and shows an overall decreasing trend. There was an increase between '75 and '79, a huge dip between '79 and '82, an increase between '82 and '85, a steady decrease through the mid-80's and mid-90's, and finally a massive drop from '95-'01.
The increases in the late 70's and early 80's are nowhere near the 700% claim by the CVU.
Further, focusing on localized increases/decreases is disingenuous when the overall trend is much lower than the national trend and (like the national trend) showing an amazing overall decline.
The rest of the statistics in the report and encouraging as well. All of them show overall declines in crime. And, I doubt very seriously you could attribute any of that to one specific thing, let alone to an increase in incarceration.
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People of the State of Oregon, we were duped into believing that “Measure 11,” would protect us against violent offenders. Violent offenders and (so called) violent offenders only because of the offenses they are charged with not what actions they actually engaged in, are not given therapeutic assistance to prevent recidivism. They are given years in Oregon prisons unequal to their crime and then set free with bad attitudes toward the justice system and without treatment because of a requirement by law not to be allowed enticements for completing programs to help prevent them from further offending prior to release. Now we have voted in Measure 57 purely by default of a obviously wrongly written initiative giving us but little choice. Which had less to do with stopping crime then it did to enhance the pockets of a professional petitioning company owned by the petitioner? Do you want your vote to count? Read before you sign and don't sign any initiative which gives but a choice of two evils. Don't vote yes on any measure which enacts a law requiring a ridiculous % of votes to over turn. We make mistakes but it is our right to make our wrongs right with real choices. Also remember, that any law passed without specific available monies to fund it is not a good law. Instead they are a draw upon the resources we would prefer to spend upon our children's education and welfare. Vote for our children and grandchildren, not for fear mongers who are not willing to be upfront with you in the first place.
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In short to court at sentencing my child: A child told OR Grand Jury the horror of 3yrs violently raped by a step-father. Mother purposefully manipulated facts&convinced the G Jury not to believe her son. Mother, G.J,& DA caused as much trauma as step-father.Under threat of long forced abandonment of his children my child bargained for (mand.sent.of over 6yrs) Violent s-father in 94 would receive less for worse eligiblefor therapy&early release. Violent abuser escapes punishment later to find nonviolent victim going to prison in his place. Mand.law allowDA to punish 2 more innocent children taking loving father during their most influential yrs. He turned himself in to enable help for that which another caused him to come to do. What intentional criminal would do what this brave young man did? Because of statutes of mand.reporting, help was not allowed outside of the prison sys. Risked all to seek help. At age 17 I entered the Marines fought an unjust war children were forced by threat of Fed Prison to maim, burn,&kill children&their families. Now called heroes? Then we were called baby killers! I ask court to defy laws that have stripped from court ability to give meaning to what children were required to recite in school,“And justice for all.”Give this young man, a victim in his own right, punishment equal to the actual crime. When will OR, its courts, &people take notice they are creating the criminals they sentence? When will the injustice stop?
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As a twenty plus year Department of Corrections employee I know where some of the budget is being mishandled. In the last eighteen months the DOC has decided to fill all of their vacant correctional officer positions. This was done despite other state agencies having to implement a hiring freeze. It was done despite the fact that paying overtime is cheaper than hiring these new officers. It was done at the same time our training budget was not funded and training was cut to levels I've never witnessed. If there is to be an honest assessment of the state corrections budget hiring policies need to be examined. When I tried to raise the issue it fell on deaf ears and I quickly became aware that there was no analysis within the department on the cost effectiveness of its hiring policies.
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Comments are now closed.
Budget cuts to prisons first imply that potentially violent and recidivist criminals will be released back into the relatively low-crime environment of today, and they'll face even less opportunity for improving their lot than when they were incarcerated.
I might be affected by more hate crime, robbery, burglary, theft, murder and so on. But the other day I was involved in a negative incident which made me think about the recent TOL discussion: Portland, the best city in the world.
I laughed with relief because the incident didn't turn ugly. I then thought that maybe I shouldn't have written, "Portland isn't a friendly place." Perception is 9/10ths of reality or some such.
There are criminals on Wall Street, in government and corporations, and those locked up behind bars by our punitive justice system. Rich criminals indirectly terrorize society by creatively destroying society's bastions, and by producing poor criminals who terrorize society directly. There are too many criminals whether they are imprisoned or slither about freely.
George Carlin said the poor are created by the rich to scare the Hell out of the middle class. The middle class is disappearing yet George's observation goes dismissed as the ravings of a professional gadfly. I miss St. George laying his potty-mouthed sword to the backsides of our society's numerous dragons.
The cure remains the elimination of the causes of fear, ignorance, poverty and suffering. Education and opportunity are necessary for the development of a worthy society. True manners, morals, ethics, compassion and justice are the lubicrants which will keep society functioning strongly and creatively.