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Reading the Northwest Weather
- LATEST COMMENTS
- As a gorge dweller, I'm sorry I missed the ... - jwswamp
- Oops, that was Western View Jr High. I understand it ... - Tom D Ford
- How does lightning 'fix nitrogen' and help plants? Does it ... - jacob
Before I moved here from the Northeast, I'd been led to believe that Pacific Northwest weather was limited to a constant drizzle. (And my knowledge of the landscape could have been summed up by Bill Murray's weather-man character in Groundhog Day: "Up in the Pacific Northwest, as you can see, they're gonna have some very, very tall trees.") But the last two years have been a lesson in extremes: flooding in Vernonia, the "Arctic Blast" of 2008, record heat a few months ago, and fogs and clouds and mists with subtle but never-ending variety. Folks back home in the Northeast sometimes talk as if they've cornered the market on four-season life. They're wrong.
As we make the next seasonal switch — from sun to, yes, drizzle — we're spending an hour talking about the peculiarities and mysteries of Northwest weather with Cliff Mass, the University of Washington atmospheric scientist who has written the book on it.
We'll talk about how climate change is likely to affect daily life in the coming decades. And how we can all become savvier cloud readers and weather predictors. As well as some practical questions for the coming winter: how cold, and how wet, might it be? (This weekend's meeting of the Oregon Chapter of the American Meteorological Society might produce some answers as well.)
What would you like to know from one of the region's most prominent weather experts? What meteorological phenomena have flummoxed you? What are your best Northwest weather stories?
GUEST:
- Cliff Mass: Professor of atmospheric sciences at the University of Washington and author of The Weather of the Pacific Northwest
Tagged as: climate change · weather
Photo credit: Curtis Gregory Perry / Creative Commons
COMMENTS: (38 total)
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"To see how Gorge trees bend and dance in the wind is endlessly fascinating."
I think of watching the ocean swirling in tide pools when I see the winds swirling trees around like that. It's cool to see the air currents affecting trees and bushes like that and imagine what the air current looks like. It's almost like watching a shadow to realize what the shadow maker is doing.
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Seems to me that the last three years have been particularly bad, with upper level low after upper level low hanging off the coast. It does appear that the North Pacific High hasn't been around much lately, and that's what drives the big west wind days in the Corridor and at Doug's. Maybe Cliff can comment on the missing NPH? Please?
Maybe it's just that I've been forecasting Gorge wind these last three years and paying way too much attention...
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Since I brought up Groundhog Day, I can't resist another (weather-related) GD reference. This is from when weatherman Phil Connor, caught in a massive snow storm, is trying to drive home to Pittsburgh:
Phil: Hey commander, what's going on?
State Trooper: There's nothing going on. We're closing the road. Big blizzard moving in.
Phil: What blizzard? It's a couple of flakes.
State Trooper: Don't you listen to the weather? We got a major storm here.
Phil: I make the weather! All of this moisture coming up out of the Gulf is gonna push off to the east and hit Altoona.
State Trooper: Pal, you got that moisture on your head. Now you can go back to Punxsutawney, or you can go ahead and freeze to death. It's your choice. So what's it gonna be?
Phil: [pauses] I'm thinking...
(Thanks, IMDB!)
David Miller — Wed Oct. 14th 1:57p.m.
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Oh man, I had to go and put "Groundhog Day" in my Netflix instant queue as soon as I stopped laughing. That movie never gets old. ...It might if I ended up stuck in a loop and had to watch it every day...
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Since you're a committed fan, you might enjoy these two (count 'em, two!) hours of radio about Groundhog Day I produced at my old show:
http://www.radioopensource.org/groundhog-day/
http://www.radioopensource.org/groundhog-day-day-two/
David Miller — Fri Oct. 16th 9:06a.m.
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Cool, I'll check it out after the show.
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"I'd been led to believe that Pacific Northwest weather was limited to a constant drizzle."
Yep, that's right, and don't let anyone tell you it's dry and sunny just over the hill to the east. Henh.
One thing I've heard from Portlanders is that Los Angeles, CA folks don't know what real rain is but LA gets bigger rains than Portland does. They are real downpours, such that LA doesn't even bother with storm drains, they just let it run off down the streets. Portland just gets longer mind numbing drizzles.
I've worked building commercial buildings in Portland with 4 inch roof drains and the same size roofed buildings in LA use 12 inch downspouts.
And Las Vegas gets rains so bad that one old man fell down while trying to set across a street gutter and was swept under a car and drowned.
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Thanks for explaining about thunderstorms causing that difference, I didn't know the why of it.
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Could you ask Professor Mass to describe the effects of El Nino on Northwest weather patterns? I understand a promient El Nino or La Nina effect is expected this winter particularly affecting California. Are these related to volcanic activity? Will the recent summer eruption of Mt Redoubt affect us?
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Something I've been wondering about is what the effect of global warming might be on our local climate. Our climate seems to be driven by the ocean and the jet stream, and the heat waves seem to come from the desert (east). Should we expect more heat waves, or more moisture because of increased evaporation from the ocean, or...?
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For someone who follows the weather closely, what is is your opinion on global warming/ global climate change versus normal variability? Is the northwest less rainy and more sunny as a result of this trend?
How does lightning 'fix nitrogen' and help plants? Does it improve soil only in sites of high lightning or is it gaseous ammonia? Should gardeners rejoice with lightning storms?
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When that Columbus Day storm hit I was in after school football practice at Mountain View Jr High in Corvallis. After the winds blew a metal roof off a nearby barn the coach finally called off practice for the day and sent us home.
On the way home I had to ride my bicycle around a downed power line that the wind was whipping around all over the street. That was scary but cool for a kid that age.
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Yes! Hurricanes in Florida were a blast when I was a kid. It was always fun to ride a bike in driving winds and rain.
...of course, I was never affected by anything like Andrew. Even though I grew up in the Tampa Bay area on the Gulf coast, we never really received a really devastating hurricane in that area.
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Oops, that was Western View Jr High. I understand it no longer exists.
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I've lived on the Central oregon Coast for 19 years - after New York, Seattle and San Francisco. This is the only place I've lived where you hear things like "the wind's only around 50 or 60" or "the power'll be back in 5 or 6 days" or other advice about weather. I don't think our weather is wimpy! Mary
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KLCC gives Central Oregon Coast weather reports and I think they ought to call it the Oregon Central Coast to make clear the difference.
For some reason when I hear that I always think of the Central Oregon Coast as Drake Park in Bend.
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The reason that air passing over the mountains drops on the other side doesn't have anything to do with temperature changes and it isn't because of a vacuum. It's gravity!
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Very interesting show and time-appropriate since I have been really reviewing weather phenomena, especially around mountains, for my commercial flight training.
Such a different world out here. I am so used to Florida's quick afternoon thunderstorms almost every day during summer, the almost constant heavy rain because of the tropical depressions/storms and hurricanes during the fall, then great weather in the winter and spring.
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If you fly sailplanes high over the Cascades you can call up the Seattle air traffic control folks and they will reroute commercial air traffic to go around you. Cool huh?
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Yeah, sailplanes have the right-of-way as the less maneuverable aircraft. If I were a sailplane pilot, though, I would probably opt to stay out of the published arrival/departure routes. ...but, I guess you have to go where the thermals are.
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This Professor Cliff Mass fellow is really interesting.
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I survived the Columbus Day storm. I was about two and hovered nervously around my grandparents because the house was shaking and the wind howled through the power lines like a stadium full of angry ghosts upset with a referee's missed call.
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I did, too, I was in 6th grade, home from school and looking out our large whindow when I saw a cat blowing down the street. I freaked out and ran to Mother. I will remember that sight of the flying cat forever
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I'm from Tornado Alley (Kansas/Iowa) where doppler radar is common. There was talk a few years ago, probably an anniversary of the Columbus Day storm, of putting doppler radar on or just off the northwest coast to warn about future storms. What is the status of that?
Thanks,
John Gram
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What causes fog? Why do we not get so much of it here on the central Oregon coast as they seem to in California?
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Oh, Sunriver gets lots of fog, especially freezing fog in the winter. Central Oregon gets our share, for sure.
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I've read that the traditional wine grape growing regions of OR, such as Yamhill county, will get too warm to support high quality vineyards as global warming hits the Pacific Northwest. I've also read that certains areas of the North Coast will become ideal areas for vineyards. How accurate are these predictions?
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On my office desk I happen to have a scrapbook on the Columbus Day Storm. In it I have news clips and pictures from my house in Hillsboro where I grew up. Quoting from it: " What Happened at our Home: 39 trees blew down. We were in Eastern Oregon at Lehman Hot Springs. We came home on Sunday the 14th. Our lights came on later that night" I remember cooking dinner in the fireplace that night. What I remember most is that our two acres were covered with branches and limbs 2 feet thick over the whole property. It took us 2 years to clean up the mess. With the 39 fir trees down we had a logger come in and haul the trees out.
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I observed, one winter, during a frontal event, on the RTX doppler radar, VAD winds display-winds in excess of 100 kts at 4000' MSL.
Later NASA was flying the coast into storms to gather data on low-level jet streams.
Question: have there been any published articles concerning low level jets stream?
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when i lived in the midwest, a bottle-green colored sky was a pretty serious indicator of an impending tornado. I live in welches on Mount Hood and occasionally see the same bottle-green color in a rainy day sky. What causes this unusual color and why is it NOT an indicator of 'tornadic' activity here? tarbeau642
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Professor Mass, do you keep up on what the NASA and Air Force weather folks are doing and learning down at Cape Canaveral?
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Remember hiking Dog Mountain one April day and the west wind averaged 40 mph. My video camera recorded footage of wind dancing with wild flowers as clouds tumbled past Wind Mountain below. I remember wearing all my layers and still being cold, wet and happy. (You can keep sunny and mild weather days for yourself.) Surprisingly, I seldom get rained on as I hike in the Gorge. Perhaps I've subconsciously learned to time the weather patterns. Some years I average 30-40 hikes and get rained on three times at most.
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Emily, You asked your guest one of my favorite questions, and he completely blew it. It makes me question his qualifications. You asked him to tell the difference between fog and clouds. He said there's no difference, that fog is just a low cloud. You correctly noted that sometimes the fog is high, but he ignored that. The huge difference is that fog occurs during high pressure, what would otherwise be what we call "good" weather. When it burns off, the sun is there, waiting to shine. Clouds occur during periods of low pressure, which usually lead to precipitation of some kind. Virtually opposite weather phenomena, which often look the same at first glance--at the very least an interesting discussion of a Northwest phenomenon that is often misunderstood. -Christina, Corvallis
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First off, I'd like to say that this was the best TOL ever!
Second, with all due respect to Cliff, buying a ski pass this season isn't a "mistake." Sure, El Nino years are warmer and drier than La Nina or neutral years, but we still get snow. The average snowfall is around 250 inches in an El Nino year, about half of normal. Some years have more, and some have less. This translates to an average base of around 70 inches at T-Line and Meadows. Not epic, but totally skiable. And hey, making turns on the mountain is way better than being stuck in the inversion in the Gorge or the clouds in Portland!
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With all due respect for Cliff, lenticular clouds were not responsible for getting UFO sightings started in the Northwest. It was Kenneth Arnold, a pilot with over 9k hours flying experience that saw 9 objects over Mount Rainier on July 24, 1947. That is a gross misrepresentation of the facts. I am surprised your guest has never come across this very well documented case. Here something to get him started:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenneth_Arnold
Regards,
Ben -
How does lightning 'fix nitrogen' and help plants? Does it improve soil only in sites of high lightning or is it gaseous ammonia? Should gardeners rejoice with lightning storms?
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As a gorge dweller, I'm sorry I missed the program (due to good weather !).
We get to watch the clouds sweep by the Vista House, they often go too fast, and must go over rather than around. The upper level clouds are move in opposite directions.
Troutdale weather is minor compared to narrower and higher places in the west gorge). Unique things are:
The refraction issues when high wind and bitter cold cause the horizon to move in a wave in a similar manner as hot pavement. Landing lights of airplanes jump up and down several thousand feet.
The icicles grow OUT of the ground, an entire field of frostie 3-4" icicles form, pointing away from the wind.
With freezing rain, the barb wire fences grow to 100mm wide, horizontal bands of ice.
Interesting to witness, but I can no longer afford the price of admission ($33/day property taxes). I hope I can find a 'weather watcher' to buy this joint.
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As a windsurfer I've been fascinated by wind (and more recently the gustiness thereof) in the Columbia Gorge.
My impression is that westerly Gorge Winds used to be steadier and stronger. In the last 10 years I don't recall seeing the huge cloud bank at the west end of Hood River as frequently as in the past.
What causes Gorge Winds? Are Gorge winds diminishing or gustier over the last 20 years?
Why are Willamette Valley and Portland heat spells usually short lived? Can Cliff explain the dynamics of the Summer Oregon Heat Low?
Is rainfall in the Olympic rain forest diminishing? Are other rain forests in the northwest being affected by climate change? Is the climate really changing, or could we be entering a period our relatively short weather history hasn't yet recorded?
Has clear-cut logging and increased housing density driven up the average temperarture of the Northwest?
Stop at Rooster Rock Park on a windy Fall day and lean into the biting cold wind. If the wind blows strongly enough it will support your weight. You might even get toppled and rolled across the lawn if the wind goddess favors you.
Hiking one warm Fall day at Wahkeena Falls in the west Columbia Gorge. The easterlies howled and threw up "liquid smoke" off the river swell's flames. I saw a tree snap at its base and fall across power lines. A fire started in the roadside brush but was quickly snuffed out.
To see how Gorge trees bend and dance in the wind is endlessly fascinating. I call the jet-like roar of wind through tree canopies "tree jets".
I love this place and have trouble imagining calling any other place "home".