Oregon’s unemployment has improved in the last few months. In some cases, that’s because more people have found work. But there are also people who left the unemployment rolls for other reasons.
Thousands of people get tossed off unemployment every month. Rob Manning reports on one Oregonian who’s contesting the decision to cut his benefits.
The state supported his taking a career re-training program, and that’s where questions about his status began.
Keeping track of the Employment Department’s priorities can be confusing for some out of work Oregonians, like John Wiebke.
He’s 48.
He’s married with two young kids.
These days he’s often watching his two-year-old son, Matthew.
Wiebke is an experienced urban planner. He lost his job at David Evans & Associates, a little over a year ago, and he’s been cycling through unemployment benefits and extended benefits ever since. They pay him $426 a week.
John Wiebke: “It’s stressful. It’s a combination, depressed sometimes, and you’re wondering about the future, if you’re going to be able to get back in the workforce. At the same time, this is a perfect age to be able to spend time with the kids.”
So when he had the opportunity to take a class on sustainable building two days a month, as a way to enhance his career options, he took it.
The class started in October, and ends in June. Wiebke learned about the class through a state employment program. The $2400 tuition is paid for through a grant from the state.
Then last month he got a call from an adjudicator with the Employment Department about the class, and whether it affected his job search. He’d been questioned about this before, and he was familiar with this question.
John Wiebke: “If I was offered a temporary position, and it required me to drop the course, would I do so? I said ‘yes I would’.”
But this time, the questioner asked for more details, and asked the question several times in different ways. She asked him if he would drop the class even for employment that lasted a short time.
John Wiebke: “Finally, she specified, if it was only for two or three days, would I drop the class? Well, I replied that I wouldn’t need to because I can miss at least one day.”
That is, Wiebke told her he could miss one day of the class and still continue the training.
John Wiebke: “Then she asked me again would I drop the class? I kind of replied, well I guess the standard answer is I have to say ‘yes.’ She said ‘you don’t need to tell me what you think I need to hear.’ I kind of went back to my old answer that ‘Well no, because I wouldn’t need to drop the class, but ultimately if I had to, I would’.”
His answer -- about his willingness to drop a state-funded class for a hypothetical temporary job that would last a couple of days -- resulted in Wiebke’s benefits being denied. State officials say his answer raised questions about his “credibility.”
George Berriman is the state’s Unemployment Insurance program manager. He says students who are enrolled in school -- even with a state-funded grant -- have to meet the same standard to keep their benefits as anyone else.
George Berriman: “They need to be able, available and actively seeking work both full- and part-time for the normal days and hours for the type of work they’re seeking.”
The Department of Employment denied unemployment benefits to more than 25,000 people in 2010 for not being adequately available for work, according to official reports.
Berryman says school was involved in more than 5000 denials.
Wiebke called the Director’s office to contest the denial, and was able to get back on the unemployment rolls. But Employment Department denied his claim for a week in March. He’s appealed to get that money back— about $426.
Wiebke was granted a telephone hearing on his appeal with an administrative law judge. It took place last Tuesday. Wiebke asked permission to record that hearing, and provided a copy of the recording to OPB.
During the 49-minute phone call, Judge Shelly Lee put a series of questions to Wiebke. She also asked questions of the Employment Department.
One of the issues she raised echoed the central question Wiebke has asked since his benefits were denied.
Shelly Lee: “If the Employment Department is funding his attending school, why are they now trying to deny him benefits?”
The Department responded that even though a state of Oregon grant paid for the class, the community college class isn’t one of the Employment Department’s own programs. If it had been, things might have been different. George Berriman explains.
George Berriman: “If you’re certified for one of those programs, then your work-search requirements are waived while you’re in the training. But generally, those are classes that are twenty or more hours per week.”
The administrative law judge also wanted to know what exactly was wrong with Wiebke’s answers, if he ultimately said he was willing to drop the class.
That’s when the Employment official said it was an issue of his “credibility.” George Berriman says that’s an even bigger issue with a full-time student.
George Berriman: “He may say that ‘I will drop all these classes, and will take full-time work.' But then, this person received all these grants, if I were to drop out of school right now, I’d have to start, within 30 days, to start paying all the money back. So you have to look at all these different things when you’re deciding the credibility.”
Wiebke, for his part, says he was trying to give honest answers.
The Department says out of more than 12,000 benefits decisions involving students last year, 5100 were denials. For non-students, the denial rate -- on the basis of a person’s availability for work -- is higher than that.
The Employment Department regularly emails unemployed Oregonians about career classes. Wiebke says he jumped at the opportunity to take the class, as a way to boost his skills. He says he went to an information session on the class last fall, and he wasn’t the only one who was eager to take it.
John Wiebke: “They got inundated with so many people that the room they were in was just packed – they couldn’t get any more in. There was a lot of interest in this. I listened to what they had to say, and it seemed to dovetail nicely with where I wanted my career to be directed towards.”
Wiebke says he’s still actively looking for work. He has a spreadsheet listing 300 conversations he’s had about potential employment since losing his job.
Wiebke is waiting to hear a final decision on his appeal about the money that he was denied in March. Ever since the Employment Department raised these questions, he says he’s been required to submit extra paperwork to get benefits for the one week each month when he spends two days in class.