The federal government shutdown is now a week old and shows little sign of ending. On Monday, Senators rejected for the fifth time competing proposals from Republicans and Democrats to pass a funding bill to reopen the government.
Among other concessions, Democrats are demanding Republicans agree to extend tax credits set to expire for 24 million Americans who get their health insurance under the Affordable Care Act. Republican Congressional leaders insist any negotiations on healthcare take place after Democrats agree to reopen the government.
Meanwhile, the Trump administration has threatened to lay off members of the federal workforce and to withhold back pay of furloughed federal workers. Active-duty members of the military could miss their first paycheck next Wednesday if Congressional lawmakers fail to reach a deal before then. Shortages of air traffic controllers, who are required to work without pay during a government shutdown, have led to delays of flights at busy airports.
Oregon Democratic U.S. Sen. Ron Wyden joins us from Washington, D.C., to discuss the latest developments in the government shutdown.
Note: The following transcript was transcribed digitally and validated for accuracy, readability and formatting by an OPB volunteer.
Dave Miller: This is Think Out Loud on OPB. I’m Dave Miller. We are now one week into the federal government shutdown. For an update on what’s happening, I’m joined now by Ron Wyden. He is Oregon’s senior Democratic U.S. Senator. Sen. Wyden, welcome back.
Ron Wyden: Thanks for having me.
Miller: The central issue in this debate is that Democrats want to extend tax credits that are set to expire for something like 24 million Americans who get their health insurance through Affordable Care Act exchanges. Republicans insist that negotiations on health care should take place after the government is reopened. Where do you see room for compromise right now?
Wyden: Well, it takes two to get going and you can’t negotiate with yourself. What’s at stake here is affordable health care for millions of Americans. And I’m, as you know, the ranking Democrat on the Finance Committee. And one of the areas that has concerned me is that we saw billions of dollars in tax breaks for billionaires, and we’re cutting Medicaid and taking back tax breaks. So there are big, big issues on the line. And everybody knows me – and this is pretty clear – I will work with anybody, Dave, who wants to do the right thing. But you got to have two people who want to negotiate.
Miller: Let’s say that there are two sides negotiating. Where do you see room for compromise?
Wyden: I don’t see any evidence that they want to do it. I’ve made it clear that I think in the area of health care cost containment, there’s a lot to do. For example, something called upcoding, one of the biggest rip-offs there ever was. It basically takes a small health care problem, and the insurance companies blow it up and then they can get huge checks from taxpayers. So there’s plenty that we can compromise on on major issues with respect to cost containment.
But the Republicans have all the branches of government right now, all of them. And we need them to say “look, we want to talk with you.” That’s all we’ve said for months now and they’re stonewalling.
Miller: The tax credits for health insurance from the Affordable Care Act exchanges, that’s gotten the most attention. But Democrats have also talked about two other major issues: the massive cuts to Medicaid from the One Big Beautiful Bill Act, and the fact that, as we heard from our Democratic colleague Jeff Merkley last week, you can’t even have faith that whatever budget you agree to will mean anything if allocations are rescinded or impounded. For you personally, do you need to see movement on all three of these issues to be a yes vote on reopening the government?
Wyden: I want to see concrete efforts to really meet the needs of people. Let’s talk about what the shutdown means right now in Oregon. Head Start is being held back. Small business loans are being held back. Social Security delays are something I’m hearing about. And I just heard this morning that prescribed burns, which is the future of forestry policy in terms of preventing fire, getting people out in the woods, that’s cut way back. And so I want to see an effort on things that really matter to people.
Miller: I want to talk about the timing here. In something like three weeks, I’ve heard November 1 as an average send-off time, something like 20 million Americans – the majority in red states – are going to be getting letters from their insurers alerting them to the fact that their premiums are going to go way up for health insurance, maybe doubling. Are you and your Democratic colleagues essentially counting on that, people receiving those letters and freaking out, in order to ratchet up pressure on Republicans?
Wyden: I’ve been talking about real examples that I’m hearing about, for example, rural Oregon. A lot of these cuts hit hardest on our rural communities where higher shares of Oregonians are enrolled in the Oregon Health Plan. So we’ve got to make sure that the people who are the most vulnerable have some assurance, particularly in health care, that they’re going to be able to deal with this, and I’m not just going to say “tough luck to you.”
Miller: But the reason I’m asking this question is it gets to timing and tactics. Government shutdowns, the stakes are super high – and call it a game of chicken, but someone has to blink and say, “the political pain being inflicted on our side is now too much and so we will come to the table.” Are Democrats, at this point, thinking that in three weeks, those letters going to people about health insurance premiums, that is what’s going to change what is the current shutdown status quo?
Wyden: Well, there is no question that United States senators who go home – and of course a lot of them don’t do town hall meetings like Sen. Merkley and I do – they are hearing that the hit is enormous. I just had a press conference with a number of advocates who talked about a couple in Eugene that were paying $440 a month. They just learned from their plan that that’s going to increase to $2,220 a month. You ask about blinking, I’m not going to blink in a way that hurts vulnerable Oregonians.
Miller: Let me turn to pressure from the other side. One of the ways that the administration is trying to put pressure on Democratically-controlled states is by freezing or canceling money that has already been earmarked for them. We’re talking about tens of billions of dollars in blue states, including more than $400 million, for example, in energy grants for Oregon. What impact do you think these tactics will have?
Wyden: Well, I think there’s no question that the president basically takes out a map and looks at the blue counties and says, “I’m going after them.” But he’s also creating emergencies in red counties, and you bet I expect that those people are going to call their elected representatives like Republicans and say, “What the hell are you doing?”
Miller: What do you have to say right now to furloughed federal workers who are afraid that they’re not going to get back pay for the time that they have been forced to not be working?
Wyden: Well, I want them to know that as the ranking Democrat on the Finance Committee, I’m going to do everything I can to fight for them. We already have made some headway with respect to the thrift plans. They can take money out without penalty, they can come back without a penalty and we’re going to be working to make sure they’re OK.
Miller: Ron Wyden, thanks very much.
Wyden: Thank you.
Miller: Ron Wyden is Oregon’s senior Democratic U.S. Senator.
I should note that, as I mentioned last week when we talked that week with Sen. Jeff Merkley, we very much want to talk with Oregon’s Republican Congressman Cliff Bentz. Last week, a spokesperson told us, “I am still working on your request. We will get back to you if we wish to move forward.” We’ve gotten no further than that after two more requests this week.
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