Henderson Ave and Brooks Wine are two Oregon wine brands that operate at different price points, but are currently faced with many of the same questions: How do wineries appeal to consumers when American alcohol consumption has waned in recent years? How do producers ease barriers to entry for wine consumption and education? How do vintners approach sustainability when wine production is facing challenges due to climate change?
Tiquette Bramlett is the founder of Henderson Ave, a collection of canned wines that launched last year. Jen Cossey is the general manager of Brooks Wine. They both join us to share more about the state of Oregon’s wine industry.
Note: The following transcript was transcribed digitally and validated for accuracy, readability and formatting by an OPB volunteer.
Dave Miller: This is Think Out Loud on OPB. I’m Dave Miller. For almost 90 years, Gallup has been asking Americans if they drink any alcohol at all, or if they’re teetotalers. In the most recent poll, only 54% said they drink. That was the lowest rate ever. For wine in particular, per capita consumption has steadily decreased for the last five years.
So what is it like to be an Oregon winemaker right now? We’re going to get two perspectives on that today. Tiquette Bramlett is the founder of Henderson Ave Wines, [which] launched last year. It’s a Portland-based producer of a line of canned wines. Jen Cossey is the general manager of Brooks Wine, an award-winning winery in Amity that was founded in 1998. Tiquette and Jen, it’s great to have both of you on the show.
Tiquette Bramlett: So great to be here. Thanks, Dave.
Jen Cossey: Thanks for having us.
Miller: Jen, first – what led you into the wine industry?
Cossey: So my wine industry story, I don’t think it’s all that unique. I think a lot of people who are in wine, as we were talking about earlier, didn’t start with the intention of getting into wine. I was actually an art student and graduated with an art degree. I was living in San Francisco, and much like many people who live in San Francisco with art degrees, I needed a second job.
Miller: That meant serving?
Cossey: Yeah, something like that. I found a job at a little wine shop in the East Bay actually. I didn’t know anything really about wine at the time. I had waited tables at some basic restaurants previously, so I thought I knew a lot. I was like, “I know what wine is,” but the truth is I didn’t. So I got a job at the bar of this little wine shop, they had about 10 different wines open every week. And I had to learn a little bit about them because people were coming in and had questions. So that’s kind of how it started for me.
And then fast forward many years, I had an interest in learning more. So I got some sommelier certifications, some spirit certifications, and beer, and a yoga certification thrown in there too just for fun, and made my way from Kansas City, which is where I grew up, to wine country, and really wanted to move to Oregon to be immersed in it. And that’s how I found my way into Oregon.
Miller: Tiquette, what about you? My understanding from reading your bio is it’s at least as circuitous as we just heard from Jen.
Bramlett: Yeah, I like to say that wine really chose me in this story. I was an opera singer first, that’s what I went to school for. I thought that that was going to be my life. And every place that we went for work, I was always around wine. So there was a real curiosity with it. I’d be sitting at the bar listening to descriptors that people would give, and I’d be asking a lot of questions to the person pouring behind the bar because I always noticed that people were really engaged with it. But a lot of the profiles that they would give of the leather and the tobacco, I was always just wanting to know what the root of that was. But also, I just loved the conversations that grew out of that.
And when I graduated from college, life happened. I got hit by a drunk driver, got diagnosed with cancer. So during that downtime, that was when my mom had presented me with the Wine Bible and said, “read this, because you’re very curious about the source.” And the one thing that I really fell in love with reading that was noticing how the community would get involved with the entire process of harvest in the old world regions. And there was something to that for me, where you watch a community come together and create this product as a gift to the world. I thought that there was real beauty to that.
I went and got my somm certification. I defended Oregon in the room more than anybody. I was down in California. And my MW kept saying. “I think you should go to Oregon and explore that, and see what happens.”
Miller:What’s your MW?
Bramlett: Master of Wine, so my instructor, basically. I went up, came up here on a whim, met somebody standing in line at Screen Door. I told him about the wine that had inspired me to come up here. He happened to know the person that was the head of national sales at the winery that I wanted to work at. I went and interviewed there that weekend and got hired, and the rest is literally history.
Miller: Where did the name Henderson Ave for your new wine company, a year old or so, come from?
Bramlett: Henderson Ave came from the street that I grew up on in the Bay Area. I named it that because it was really the catalyst for the gathering of everybody for us in our neighborhood. We were the nucleus for everybody, including my own family, where we would always come and gather at our house every weekend. The celebrations, all the big conversations, those all happened on Henderson Ave.
Miller: What’s the connection between that and your philosophy for wine?
Bramlett: Yeah, I think that wine is a catalyst for the gathering. I think being a part of community and leading and being able to have those bigger conversations, wine can be a catalyst for that thing. And I just felt like it was a no-brainer for me of being able to bring the two together.
Miller: Jen, what about Brooks Wine? It’s older. You didn’t start it. It’s been around since 1998, as I mentioned, so almost 30 years now. How do you describe it?
Cossey: Well, I think what Tiquette is saying really resonates with me as well, it has been and still is about community. It’s about bringing people together to celebrate life, the seasons and nature. I think Brooks in particular, amongst Oregon winery, is really focused on the seasons and changing. We’re a biodynamic vineyard, we’re certified biodynamic, we’re a B Corp, 1% For The Planet. And the sustainability piece is not just like a tagline for us, it really is in every decision we make. So our community is not just about the people who come in the door, it’s about the team that works there and the land that’s all around us, and how we grow that and develop it. Since its birth in ’98, it has really been about that. It’s one of the things we continue to hold as our true north.
Miller: When you hear numbers or see numbers like the ones I mentioned at the beginning, what goes through your mind?
Cossey: Well, it’s true, we’re seeing it, and we feel it in a lot of ways. I think, at Brooks, we face it in a little different way than other people do. Everyone has their own way of looking at how economies evolve and how the drinking culture changes, and taking in those things that are important to us, which are about community and remembering what it’s about. So finding ways to bring people together more is not only a way to face those numbers, but also take the opportunity to remind people what wine is really about. It’s not about building cellars, and collecting, and the pomp and circumstance around it. It’s about what it has always been about since its birth, which is really coming together at a table, opening a bottle, sharing stories, coming together as a family or as friends. And I think coming back to that idea is a really exciting prospect for us at Brooks.
Miller: Do you see similar trends in Oregon? The ones I mentioned, the Gallup numbers about “yes or no, do you drink alcohol,” and then from the Wine Institute, the drop in per capita consumption of it since 2022 – those are national numbers. Do you see anything similar mirrored in Oregon?
Cossey: Oh, absolutely. It’s very top of mind in a lot of the conversations around Oregon producers, business leaders, around all alcohol categories, but specifically around wine. That’s what we can speak to because that’s our community. It’s a large topic of conversation. And again, I’d love to turn it around to opportunity: what’s this look like in terms of how we mold the wine industry moving forward?
And Oregon has an opportunity to be a thought leader in this, which I think is really exciting. Oregon is a younger region in terms of the national stage, and is still growing in acclaim as Tiquette was mentioning, she had to kind of fight the good fight for Oregon in front of people who are so used to California wines and some of the other historical vineyards. I think Oregon really has an opportunity to shine in this moment because community is at the core of how we built this industry in Oregon and is at the core of most of the business models.
We see, at Brooks at least, some of the information that we have shows a reflection around people being mindful about their health. And that kind of recalibration of how much they drink, when they drink, who they drink with, how they drink is affecting the consumption amounts. But it isn’t necessarily affecting their want or desire to connect in person. So I think that’s where there’s sort of a light at the end of the tunnel for us, and the best opportunity.
Miller: We asked wine drinkers on Facebook whether they were drinking more or less in recent years and what they see among their friends. Jean Schifferns wrote this: “Less, not because I want to, but because I know little to no alcoholic beverages are best for my health. A special occasion calls for a good glass of vino, though.”
Alice Gilson Hepburn wrote: “I’m 65 years old and I find myself drinking less wine, but I’m more selective about my choices.”
You’re nodding there Tiquette. How did you reckon with these nationwide trends, and statewide ones, when you were starting your own wine business at the same exact time?
Bramlett: Going back to what Jen was saying and recognizing it more as an opportunity, that’s really what I was thinking about. I was asking a lot of my friends what these trends were, because in my community too, a lot of people were drinking less and focusing more on their mental health and their wellness. So thinking about that and saying if I can start breaking down the science behind the juice, there was a real opportunity there. Instead of taking that 750 [mL] and feeling pressured to drink this entire bottle of wine – a standard sized bottle of wine – I kept thinking about if I had something that was 250 mLs, that’s a glass-and-a-half for somebody. And it can be good juice for them to enjoy, so you’re not feeling like you’re overindulging in something.
Miller: And you’re calling it juice.
Bramlett: [Laughter] Exactly, just enjoying a little bit of juice.
But also, being able to celebrate the person. I was always really big on telling people, like, “You are the occasion. It doesn’t need to be a special occasion for you to enjoy this wine.” And what we’ve done with Henderson Ave is flipped a lot of the experiences on its head, where rather than going into a traditional setting of being in a tasting room or sitting at a dinner, we partner with yoga studios. We’ve been at pilates spaces. They’re doing a whole yoga session, and then coming out afterwards and enjoying some juice or enjoying a wine spritz, having some snacks and being able to gather. So showing that you don’t always have to be in this party setting, you don’t always have to be in a formal setting going in there and tasting through an entire flight. You can enjoy some good sips and we can introduce you to what Oregon represents.
Miller: To go back to the can thinking, so part of that really was, it was not the material of the container, but let’s sell our wine in smaller doses so people don’t feel like, “I’ve opened a 750 mL bottle, I got to drink the whole thing.”
Bramlett: Yeah. There’s a level of pressure to it. I am guilty of it where people have come to my house and opened my fridge and seen that I have six bottles open hanging out because I didn’t want to drink the same one every night. So thinking about that for myself, I was like, “I just want to have a good glass of wine.” So thinking about that and knowing if I say this, I’m not the only person thinking this.
Miller: Jen, to go back to you, I’m curious how you think about price. Health and drinking habits are one thing, but price point is another.
Cossey: Yeah, price is definitely important. I really appreciate Tiquette’s size initiative as well, I think smaller sized bottles are really helpful. We love the magnums, which are the double bottles, and we see half bottles. I love buying a half bottle because you don’t always want to have a full one, I think that’s important. And it also connects to price sensitivity. We see people’s behaviors changing around wine consumption or wine purchasing, often it has to do with financial reasons, as well as health reasons.
The financial piece for us at Brooks has always been at the core of how we think about pricing, and I think Brooks kind of falls in the middle. We’re not inexpensive, but we cap out at … $80 is our most expensive bottling. We make about 40 different wines a year and only one of those is $80. It goes all the way down to $35, our least expensive. So we have something kind of for everybody as far as those price ranges go.
I think from wine club perspective too, which has been sort of the bread and butter of so many traditional wineries in the past, finding ways to create entry points for everyone has been at the core of how we’ve been addressing this issue as well. We want to build that community without necessarily putting the pressure on people to spend a lot of money, because free finances are just harder than they have really been in a long time for people. So that’s how we’re responding to that.
Miller: If daily drinking is down, but people are talking more about special occasion drinking or celebratory times together, does that suggest that there’s more opportunity for higher priced wines?
Cossey: I think it is about value to product. I think it’s about finding wines that fit your palette that you love. So that could be a $500 bottle of wine or it could be a $20 bottle of wine. I think that’s what’s really great about wine and making sure we’re opening the doors to everyone. What we’re seeing is, yes, maybe less bottles, less consumption, but more thoughtfulness around it. And I think that thoughtfulness around how we consume and what we consume is really a win, because it means we’re thinking more about what we’re putting in our bodies, what we’re consuming, the businesses we’re supporting and the values that they drive, versus sort of just blind consumerism – which I think is really great for everybody. And I think it puts pressure on businesses to do better, honestly.
Miller: Some more comments from Facebook. Brett Howell wrote: “I’m 35 years old. Over the previous five years, I’ve noticed the majority of my friends transition from drinking craft beers and cocktails to wine. In general, most people around my age are drinking less than five to 10 years ago.”
And we got this from Liam Whitworth: “It’s so refreshing to see people my age prioritizing their well-being over social pressures to drink. All of my friends across age groups, but especially those under 35, are drinking much less than ever before.”
Tiquette, there does seem to be survey data to back that up. According to that Gallup poll I mentioned, people ages 18 to 34 reported lower levels of drinking than all the adults who are older than them. How do you think about the next generation of people … 21 and older, different than Gallup’s numbers, they don’t even talk about the legality [Laughter]. But nevertheless, how do you think about the future of your potential consumers?
Bramlett: For me, it’s a lot of the storytelling that they want to know about the producers. I always talk to people about going back to the root and to the source of where that juice comes from.
Miller: This was sort of made fun of by Portlandia 10 years ago. But you’re saying it’s true, you actually hear among your customers, they actually really do want to know where your grapes were grown or who grew them?
Bramlett: And who touched them. They really want the story behind it, they want to know where their dollar is going. I think that there’s a big value of us being able to share that. And in Oregon, I think it’s something that we do a really great job on and we’re improving on that more and more every day. But I think it is critical to listen to what community and consumers are telling us. And they’re saying, “I want to know you, the person, and what you are about and what I’m supporting. Because then I will be a believer and I will invest in your product.”
Miller: You mentioned before you became a sommelier, and before you got into the business, hearing about notes of tobacco or leather. Is that the way you describe your wines now?
Bramlett: No. I’ve always seen color and I hear music when I taste wine. So for me, that’s always been the relatable factor when I am talking to people, because it breaks everything down. And then I start painting that picture of “this is what I would be doing in this space while I’m enjoying this wine.” And all of a sudden, it demystifies the wine for people a little bit more and makes it that much more approachable, so that they realize that there’s really no wrong answer to how you’re enjoying this wine.
Miller: Jen, do you find that there are still people who see the wine world, tastings, flights and everything you’re talking about, as being exclusive and snobby? Is that still something you feel like you have to fight against?
Cossey: I think so, yeah. I think the perception for people who maybe haven’t had the opportunity to experience wine might have that. But I think most places are trying to break that down. Businesses like Tiquette’s and Brooks are trying to create experiences. And again, to kind of nod to your earlier question about a younger audience of over 21 drinkers, they’re very experience-driven. They want to connect with experiences and they want wine to be part of it, it’s just not the centerpiece. And what we’ve done, and what has worked for so long for wineries is wine has been the centerpiece. And when wine is the centerpiece or a brand is the centerpiece, that’s what creates the pretense around it. I don’t think there’s an appetite for that anymore.
So I think the more we can show up with celebration, community and breaking [down] those preconceived notions about what wine experiences are, the better. It just comes from conversations like this one happening over and over, and sharing, celebrating and having fun. We talk a lot at Brooks, like if we’re not having fun, no one coming into the tasting room is having fun either. And how can we have more fun with it?
We did an event called Brooks Wine Lab, where we did wine and sound waves, where we got silent disco headphones and we had music played. I had a really cool playlist, but we had like a bunch of a series of wines that were repeated. And the people who were there didn’t know the wines that were repeated. So I had Metallica on for one wine, and I had classical music on for the next, and I had soul on for the next one. And there were repeated wines in there, and the people’s perception of those wines were so different based on what they were listening to.
So breaking down how we taste wine, and what we do when we taste wine, and what those experiences should be, I think is the most fun part of what we get to do right now.
Miller: Jen and Tiquette thanks so much.
Cossey: Thanks, Dave.
Bramlett: Thank you.
Miller: Jen Cossey is general manager of Brooks Wine. Tiquette Bramlett is the founder of Henderson Ave Wines.
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