This weekend, our nation will commemorate the 250th anniversary of its independence.
As we approach this historic milestone, “Think Out Loud” hears from guests whose life experiences and personal histories illuminate different aspects of what it means to be an American.
Noushin Hoshyar came to the U.S. in 2010 and just last month became a naturalized citizen. She’s originally from Iran and had a dream of working in healthcare. After attending school and receiving her license in the U.S., she became a nurse, something she could not have done in Iran. Hoshyar joins us to share her story, what it means to be an American and how she is thinking about the country’s 250th anniversary this year.
Note: The following transcript was transcribed digitally and validated for accuracy, readability and formatting by an OPB volunteer.
Dave Miller: This is Think Out Loud on OPB. I’m Dave Miller. We’ve been having a series of conversations over the last two weeks as we approach the 250th anniversary of the birth of this country. We’ve heard a variety of perspectives on patriotism, service, history, what it means to be American. Our final installment of this series is with a brand new American citizen. Noushin Hoshyar grew up in Iran. She came to the U.S. in 2010 and she was naturalized as a U.S. citizen just one month ago. Noushin, congratulations and welcome to Think Out Loud.
Noushin Hoshyar: Thank you. Glad to be here.
Miller: You are a member of the Baháʼí faith, a religion that was founded in what’s now Iran in the 19th century. How are Baháʼí people treated in Iran today?
Hoshyar: Not very good, like, as a Baháʼí, we don’t have rights to go… just the basic rights. We don’t have the rights to go to university. We don’t have the rights to have any government jobs or just basic human rights. We are not free. We’re not free to practice our religion or even talk about it in public. Right now I’m talking about it on the radio, but we don’t have the rights to talk about it, to say I am Baháʼí, in Iran.
Miller: So something as basic as that.
Hoshyar: As basic as that, yeah.
Miller: What options did you see for yourself if you had stayed in Iran? What kind of a life do you imagine you’d be leading?
Hoshyar: I could say just like in my own bubble with the Baháʼís that we are all like in the same religion. I couldn’t imagine myself going out of that border, so probably ending up in a marriage, like just raising a kid and that would be it. Because just so recently, they are arresting Baháʼís just because of their religion, and one of my friend’s brother got arrested and then they called him back just to get his stuff and he ended up in hospital just because of the treatment that they had for him. So no freedom. I can’t imagine the life that I have right here in America. I can’t imagine even like 10% of that in Iran. So.
Miller: I want to get to the life that you’ve built for yourself here, but just to take this sort of step by step, when you were growing up, what did the U.S. mean to you? What were your ideas of what the United States was like?
Hoshyar: Being in Iran and thinking about America, it’s just the movies that we see, you don’t have much, like you can’t imagine being there, so you’re just watching the movies and you see America as you see in the movies.
Miller: And you did have some access to Hollywood versions then of the U.S.?
Hoshyar: Yeah, but not really.
Miller: Oh, so secret versions that you were able to download or get access to.
Hoshyar: No, we won’t be able to. But it was like an American dream, so you can dream about it, but you know it’s just a dream.
Miller: How were you able to come here 16 years ago?
Hoshyar: I came as a refugee. I had to stay in Turkey for two years to get accepted, and then through the process, I did get accepted to come to America as a resident and got my green card.
Miller: And you came to Oregon from the very beginning?
Hoshyar: Correct.
Miller: What are your first memories, not to put our situations in anything close to similar versions, I did not come here as a refugee, but in my experience the first couple of days that you spend in any new place, some of those memories are stronger than some of the memories that follow. What are your first memories of being in the U.S.?
Hoshyar: Freedom. In Iran we had to have a hijab, so the first thing as a woman I can say, I was free with how I am dressing up. So that was a big change, and it was a nice change. I can decide how I’m gonna look, how I’m gonna dress up, so it was a big thing. And it’s like, I appreciate that. I mean, I didn’t have that chance back home in Iran. We had to have a hijab all the time, even if we don’t want it. So it was the first thing that I will always remember.
Miller: Physical freedom.
Hoshyar: Physical freedom.
Miller: And expressive freedom.
Hoshyar: Yeah, yeah, I mean, as a woman, it’s like you want to kind of wear makeup, put your hair out and all of this. It was kind of always I wanted to do it, but I wasn’t allowed to. So it was a nice thing that I remember.
Miller: Was there a point when you started to feel like an American?
Hoshyar: Yes. Since the beginning, I felt supported, I felt, yes, I can talk. I can express my religion. I can say I am Baháʼí and without any judgment, nobody’s gonna say no, you’re not allowed to say you’re Baháʼí. No, you cannot say this word, you cannot talk about this. It was freedom. It was a big change. I mean, your whole life you’re hiding who you are, but here you can express it so freely without judgment. Everyone is supporting, you see Baháʼí centers here. I mean, that’s a big thing. We weren’t allowed to say we are Baháʼí. Here you see Baháʼí centers in the street when you walk around. I mean, that’s a big thing.
Miller: What brought you to Oregon in particular?
Hoshyar: We had family members here, so I came through that. I got married here to an Iranian, but… yeah.
Miller: As you noted, you ended up getting a green card. The Trump administration has been targeting green card holders for deportation. Did you have fears in recent years that if you made some small mistake, if you were pulled over and you got a speeding ticket, then that you’d have to be sent back and all the freedoms that you’ve been enjoying would disappear?
Hoshyar: I mean, yes, you do have that, like deep down. You do think about it, like I did and you know my family members, I have family members here, so we’ve seen it in public that happened. So I did have that fear, deep down. And yeah, it affects like the daily life.
Miller: Meaning it affected some of the decisions you made?
Hoshyar: No. I mean it didn’t personally affect myself, me, but I mean seeing it happening, it gives you like that, you worry, you worry about it. But no, it didn’t affect me personally, so.
Miller: When did you start the process to become a naturalized citizen?
Hoshyar: I mean, it took time, it took time for me to start working on it, but there wasn’t any main reason I’m holding on. I think I kind of started on building my own life like seven, eight years ago and got busy on this process of like who am I? Who, why, why am I doing what I’m doing, to find out all of this. And then it was last year I thought, OK, it’s time, it’s time to get my citizenship and go through this process too, it’s a must do it. I’m living here. I am building my life here.
So I didn’t want to have that, as we mentioned earlier, I didn’t want to have that worry in the back of my head, that, what about, what if it happens and I have to return, I have to leave or anything. So I said, OK, it’s time, let’s do it. I applied, I had my interview. I got accepted, but then with all of this recent things going on and you know they hold on the old ceremony. So it got canceled like a couple times for the old ceremony.
After the interview I was in contact with like error code to follow up, but they were kind of making me kind of comfortable with knowing there is no issue, it’s just taking time, so it will happen, just stay calm. But it was like, with all of the recent things going on, it was much more worriness…
Miller: With the war, you mean.
Hoshyar: Yes, yes, and I mean you don’t know for real what’s going to happen. But when I got the final date for the oath, it was like kind of honor that even with all of these things going on, I am accepted as a citizen.
Miller: Can you describe what the ceremony, the oath of citizenship, just that ceremony for you, what it was like, what kinds of emotions were going through your mind?
Hoshyar: It was emotional. It was emotional and it’s like, I see it as a like parentship, like you’re parenting a kid that is not your own. I felt like accepted. I felt like belonging. I had that belonging emotion, like I belong here. They accepted me. So it’s like I am an American now, I can say it, I am an American, because wherever you apply something or anything they have this question, are you a citizen? Now I can proudly say yes, I am a citizen. I’m an American.
Miller: Just as much a citizen as somebody who was born here.
Hoshyar: Right, yeah, so it’s a huge change.
Miller: I’ve always been struck by the language of the citizenship oath. It’s sort of old and it has some archaic words, but when you strip it down, it has some of these lines, that you have to absolutely and entirely renounce all allegiance and fidelity to any foreign state of which you’d previously been a subject or a citizen. Was that hard at all? I mean, we’ve clearly heard you say that just how narrow and discriminated against your life would have been if you’d stayed in Iran. But I’m wondering if you still felt any connection to any part of Iran, if not its government?
Hoshyar: No.
Miller: No, none.
Hoshyar: Not at all. No.
Miller: You left the country behind, fully came here, fully embraced this country, and feel no connection to the country of your origin.
Hoshyar: No, because you don’t have any good memory from that country or government, how they treated you, how they see you as a human. So there is no connection there so it was easy for me.
Miller: It was completely severed.
Hoshyar: Yeah.
Miller: Another part of the citizenship oath is that you have to swear that you will bear arms on behalf of the United States when required by law. It’s hard to imagine what that would be for a civilian, but it’s still a striking thing to have to swear that when your new country, your country of citizenship is at war, officially at war with your old one. Has the war affected the way you think about your American citizenship?
Hoshyar: I mean, as a Baháʼí, we don’t bear arms, so with that part of that oath, I had, I don’t know how to put it in a word, but they knew of this situation that I am, as a Baháʼí, I’m not allowed to have, like bear arms, and they changed that…
Miller: Pacifism is a part of the faith?
Hoshyar: Correct. Correct. And they accepted that. But as a nurse, I’m working as a nurse now, so whatever would be a need, I am happily and proudly will be able to do it and they accepted this part. And like becoming, in doing this citizenship, it brought it brighter how they respect the religion and how they respect your beliefs and don’t force you for anything, even in such a big thing of like becoming a citizen. So I really, really appreciate it and I’m grateful for all of this, all of the respect that they give to a human, despite of their beliefs and everything. So it’s so nice to see it and yeah, grateful.
Miller: You’re a nurse, as you just said. That’s something you would never have been able to do if you’d stayed in Iran.
Hoshyar: Wouldn’t be. Wouldn’t be.
Miller: Was that your plan when you got here? Did you want to be a nurse?
Hoshyar: I always looked on it, yes, I always looked of doing something in health care, so I started as a caregiver. I worked on and then I stepped up and became a nurse now, so it would be some, just a dream back home.
Miller: Yesterday we talked to a woman whose family has been here since the 1700s, but she had worked overseas and living overseas had given her, in her words, a deeper, a better understanding of this country, of the United States. In a sense, you have the opposite experience of coming from somewhere else and becoming a naturalized citizen. What do you think you might appreciate about America that native-born Americans may take for granted?
Hoshyar: This freedom.
Miller: The freedom.
Hoshyar: The freedom, the freedom of speech, the freedom of building your own life the way you want. I have seen some Americans that take it for granted, and it is not, I mean, as we heard, just because of your beliefs, you cannot have the basic rights that you have here in your own country. So don’t take it for granted, just appreciate it and be grateful for the nation that you’re living in. It’s a huge thing.
Miller: You’re about to celebrate or experience your first 4th of July as an American citizen in just two days. Do you have anything planned?
Hoshyar: Yeah, I mean, I will work at night, but for sure we’re gonna celebrate it with family before I go to work.
Miller: You have the freedom to be a nurse, but you also have to work on July 4th. Welcome to America.
Hoshyar: But I love it. I mean, I love what I’m doing. I love the way that I’m doing it and I love being an American.
Miller: Noushin, it was a real pleasure talking to you. Congratulations.
Hoshyar: Thank you.
Miller: Noushin Hoshyar is a recently naturalized citizen from Iran.
“Think Out Loud®” broadcasts live at noon every day and rebroadcasts at 8 p.m.
If you’d like to comment on any of the topics in this show or suggest a topic of your own, please get in touch with us on Facebook, send an email to thinkoutloud@opb.org, or you can leave a voicemail for us at 503-293-1983.
